After reading above comments I wonder if I qualify to share my thoughts here, given my limited experience with this exam. Many people here have given much more of their precious time as compared to what I have. Still I will try, if I can contribute with my 2 points here; with a hope that someone here might find them helpful.
Background
It has been 2.5 years now ; I took 1 full year for preparation afterleaving my job (graduated from IIT)and then gave 2019 attempt.Went till the last stage but missed the final cut off by 30 marks. It was painful.Although I did not expect much because I knew mymains did not go as I used to imaginebefore the exam. Struggled with several answers ; could not understand the exact demand of many questions (GS). Invigilator snatched the answer sheet away while I struggled to scribble something (literally scribbled) for the last 2 10 markers in the ethics paper. "That was not how it was planned" - I said to myself.
I went into subtle depression and grief post mains itself.I was shattered under my own hopes. I lived death for a month or so and I am not exaggerating. It haunted me. It was not as of I was not interested in doing anything. I could not do anything.My mind kept on asking me the same questions. Why could I not write x in that y question?I started doubting myself.
I failed in my own eyes. "Yeh kya hua, kaise hua, kyun hua, kab hua song became my reality."
I could not sleep properly. I did not enjoy going out. I did not enjoyall the fun momentswe share with our dearest of friends. Then I somehow trembled upon this wonderful thing, calledVipassana Meditation. This was quite helpful.This brings me to my first point. I wouldhighly recommend this, to all the dreamers out here Dhamma.org Please watch a youtube video on this if you get interested and then go for a 10 day retreat.
Although I will not lie and say that this changed my life. But Vipassana helped me taking back some control. Now my self destructive chain of thoughts did not last for hours but for minutes. I changed my city after mains, stopped studying, went for a holiday trip to Hampi, spent time with my loved ones, nothing was same anymore. There was a constant internal dissatisfaction.
The loong wait of 4 months ended at 1 am 15th January 2020. Although as you might guess the hopes were dim but guys that's how life is. Unexpectedly I qualified. Whereas my friends, more confident than me, could not. I am seriously not taking a cheap dig at them rather I wish to convey my confusion as well as the intensity of that moment for me. Seeing my roll number in that list was like "coming back to life". Rebirth.Which is my second point. The biggest remedy to failure in life is tasting success.All other extraneous factors can help but are not critical.Guys, however hard you've got hit this time; you can bounce back. The pit might look bottomless but there is light at the end of the tunnel.
Give another exam, try another time in this exam itself or take up other job or play a sport or hit the gym and achieve success. However small it may be but I strongly believe, it is very important for every individual to receive a little pat on the back from time to time. Just to reaffirm and validate our insecure inner self that we are on the right track and we are doing fine :)Little successes here and there, helps in maintaining self esteem and gives confidence to DREAM.
You all are DREAMERS guys. We belong to abundantly different backgrounds and aspire to realize our dreams. Becoming an IAS/IPS/IFS officer. This is what actors, athletes and other professions based on individual excellence also face. Saw the movie Dangal? Bhaag Milkha Bhaag? MS Dhoni? How painful is it to fail in life? There is no way possible to share that grief with anyone else, nor your family and neither your friends. Our society judge us by the final outcome. One can never really tell others how much of themself they had put in. How much 24 carat gold pure emotions of sacrifice and effort has gone down the drain.
Cry if you want and then come back stronger guys. Failures are a part of everyone's life. And do you know what is the best part? There would have been no fun, no joy and no ecstasy without failures. Dreamers know it the best. Because they pour their heart and soul into achieving one goal. Yet, time and again when they think, this time is their time, they fail. But they come next time until they win :) Because the win was worth it all.
We all have our fair share of successes and failures in life. Life in totality is a balancer, UPSC or no UPSC. I will end with another truism for you, which others above have also said, THIS TOO SHALL PASS, like any other success or failure in life.
Thank you for this. You do not have to have experience to share your journey. We all do not have to be perfect or right here. But what makes a community is sharing. Whatever we've got.
Thank you for this again!
Ok but@Neyawn can you comment if people have skipped and whether it has worked?
People do use a test series for a chartered preparation. However, I would also suggest you to take some modular classes if you don’t have content and don’t have the habit of making e notes from various sources + ability to make it concise for revision before exams. Any classes will help you develop the base material for individual topics of the syllabus.
» show previous quotes» show previous quotes» hide previous quotesNot being dismissive and pessimistic, but all these strategy wala post irks me after 4 failed attempts.
I never believed that mains is unpredictable, but this time, even after doing so much, i failed again.
Maybe my optional was the culprit. But having an optional is itself inviting unpredictability in the exam.
I sometime feel that all the effort ib have put into this exam isn't worth it.
To be honest this exam is ruining lives of young generation in India, who fall into trap of toppers and coaching wallas selling the idea that hard work surely pays off.
Yes it does pay off, but the risk to reward is very high in favour of risk.
I would only say that the decision to prepare wholeheartedly for this exam should be based on a rational analysis of risk and reward and never fall in the trap of - If I hard work more, I will surely crack it next time
This exam doest want individuals who are creative and innovative. It wants those who could rote learn, write fast, and have good writing skills.
Sorry to be pessimistic again.
You are not pessimistic,you are pragmatic.
Those who can rote-learn loads of facts-both relevant and irrelevant- and vomit in an eye-catching manner come across as good performers to the evaluators,who are accountable for nothing,to none.
Writing skill means not linguistic proficiency.Many recommended people are noticeably bad in this regard.
I laugh at those who waste time,energy and money on so-called test series,conducted by under-qualified naive people.
This response is not directed to any of you per se, but I have quoted your comments to set the context. It is primarily to provide a counter to the thought process that some you have put forth above. This is going to be a long one, but bear with me.
First thing is that when we are unable to clear the Mains or the Prelims ( or the Interview ), we have two ways of thinking
One, is that it is unpredictable ( and nothing can be done about it )
Two, there is something that I am not able to figure out or crack. Its simply not occuring to me.
If you think from the first perspective, we can not have an action plan. And practically, we can go ahead and pay Russian roulette with the expectation that out of several attempts, we will be able to crack in one of the attempts. And exhaust our attempts.
Also, that, we need to make no major changes, do nothing and go on and on.
If you think about the second option, you have a massive task of figuring out what is not working, what you have not understood and what others are doing right. That will require looking outside to real people ( not toppers from internet - but meeting the same folks in person - and this year as the results will come, i am very sure that may people from this community will clear and you can ping them and actually meet them . I can help with this if some of you want it )
But the major point is that we need to believe that something is being missed by me - its simply not occurring to me - and I need to find that out. And the best people to guide you are the ones who have just cleared the exam. Meet several of them, and find out what is commonly held by them, and derive your conclusions from there.
Not on anecdotal evidence.
Also, do not go by exceptions. Or the path of minimum effort. Something like - "I only studied 15 days, and did not write any tests and still I got through / go interview call".
People got through / got interview callnot becausethey only studied 15 days or didn't write any tests , butdespitestudying 15 days ORdespitenot writing any tests. That is a big difference.
It is true that the exam has high-risk reward - which is true with anything where the rewards are high. The prestige ( I am not even going to say perks, power ( which I dont think exists much anymore ), privilege, public interaction ) are insanely high - and I will not go into whether it is right or not, and why it is there in the first place. )
But risks are high not because of the effort needed. The risks are high because this is a post graduate level examination. Which means two things.
(1) Candidates are of a certain age where very soon there will be earning pressure / marriage pressure from parents / society - exceptions are always there.
(2) Candidates are already financially exhausted given that the education budget of the family is already spent in 12th coaching / graduation/ college. Hence, we have the minimum financial resources left at this stage of the exam.
(3) The seats are so less, and that getting a lower score ( such as clearing the Mains or the Interview ) is not a ticket to lesser jobs / PSUs ( unlike CAT or JEE where you can get something even if you dont top )
We do not say IIT is unpredictable because of the science-maths and humanities dichotomy ( Humanities will always have subjectivity )
If we are stuck at some stage, please note that we have to find out what is missing.
I will tell you in Civil Services, how teachers get stuck. And that is, when their notes produces some good ranks, then they dont update notes and now the notes are common, and upsc does not award marks for those notes any longer. So teachers after a few years become unpopular, unless they changes his notes.
The same happens to students also.
Consider this that between 2002-2008 almost every IAS officer you meet will say , to crack IAS, just take psychology optional and join a certain Pathak Sir.
It is not a myth.
It is a reality.
And between 2007-2012 every IAS topper will say take Pub Ad with some Mohanty Sir .
When after some years the notes are not updated ( as we are facing with Value added material of some major coachings ), we see that we stop getting marks.
This is a very harsh reality.
So if you know some senior who has 3 interview calls or 4 mains and is not making it and is stuck, a good way to break the ranks is to entirely change the base material.
Of course the senior will be comfortable with the notes as he knows that those notes at least guarantee an interview call and will be reluctant to change it, just like teachers are reluctant to change their notes because they think it is the pinnacle of all wisdom that can ever exist in the subject.
But one thing is for sure - If we have to clear this exam, we will have to accept what "is" and go ahead with it rather than try to create what "should be". Our preparation always has to align is what is, instead of what "should be" as far as exam preparation is concerned.
I will share with you something.
In the past 8 years, there have been exactly twopeoplewhom I have consciously tried to discourage from writing the exam - on grounds that they are wasting their youth and parents money. I wanted them to help me with something.
My point was that one of them had a very slow handwriting and I knew that with slow handwriting there is a glass ceiling. The other had the habit of reading things back to back, end to end without thinking in terms of "ispe question aayega toh kya likhenge" .
One of them told me point blank that "parents ne paida kiya toh kharcha toh bharenge, aur jab budhdhe ho jayenge toh hum unka bojh uthayenge ) . The other one kept quiet and doubled his / her effort.
I never discussed this with them any further, but somehow, at least one of them took it as some challenge( which was not my intention at all ) and both these people somehow cracked the exam. After cracking one of them sent me a message - You never thought I would crack the exam. They were friends. Close ones.
I can tell you that people who have pulled themselves out have accepted that something is amiss and have looked for it somehow, found it and worked on it.
Success always looks effortless and easy once it is done, but a lot of effort goes into making things look effortless.
I will give you two case studies. Take a look at this.
He scored a single digit rank.
A very common ( or common sensical ) thinking will be that he was genius and he did "nothing" - no class - no test series - and yet he got single digit rank.
When you will look from far, you will think "O he is a topper, and he is paid by coaching and what not", but the point is that you gotta meet people and see the amount of effort they are putting. It is intimidating even for me, though I see people slog day in and day out.
I can tell you that he had the choice of accepting his fate of not being able to score beyond a point and accept a certain service, ( and frankly if you ask me, I do not like the idea of leaving a comfortable service and rank and getting into the grind of rajinder nagar and ruining one's life for like six months )
He did not settle for his comfort zone, and I hate these guts, because frankly I dont have these guts.
He took classes, did test series and what not. He slogged like a beginner,and I think you should know these stories too.
Also, averagely, we cannot think beyond what we have seen or sometimes beyond our capacities.
Some of you have mentioned that you would laugh at those who do test series. If we are looking for any improvements, we have to see what is the person doing.
I am not a great advocate of doing mindless test series, but let me tell you that out of Top 10 ranks, nearly 4 do a test series like an insane person, another 3 join a test series, but do not put so much effort, and may wrote 5-6 tests and the remaining 2-3 may not join a test series.
You are practically laughing at all the people putting the effort.
Also, Let us say a student has written 8 Tests between Prelims and Mains with above average dedication. Do you know what that means.
First it means that he has done at least 24 hours of answer writing, which is when he would have fixed his speed, question handling issues.
Secondly, if he is a little sincere, he would hae studies at least 15-18 hours before every test. This means that he has done verified studied for least 120 hours - which also means that some changes would already occur in his personality as well as his preparedness, compared to someone who is waiting for prelims result.
And these are not people who are ignorant, lack exposure and are under misguidance. They are the ones who have friends and family in service, completely focussed, and they know what they are doing.
They are not doing some class or test series because they saw an AD. They did their due diligence, asked around and took decisions and held themselves accountable for those decisions.
I can tell you in my personal capacity I have met some people, whom I thought will never never never make it, and felt like telling them and yet some of them have gotten proper IAS and home cadre. To the point that I have stopped making an early assessment of anyone.
And there are at least a hundred people right on this forum ( and old discuss ) who slogged to a level ( which I personally think is not worth it - unless you want something that badly )
Toppers Taking Money and Saying they did answer writing from Day 1
So a famous educator had put a video saying that toppers take money and say that they did answer writing from day 1.
I will also like to throw some light on this phenomena here.
First is that, there is a myth that toppers of IAS exam get paid a lot by coaching institutes. This is a very clerical level thinking , very pedestrian and very low level thinking.
It is the same thinking that some people have when they pay a 100 rupee bribe to a constable and think that Delhi police commissioner gets a cut. And if a traffic constable by bribes earn 30,000 ( for the sake of example ) , then Delhi CP would be making x,y, crores.
This is a very simplistic thinking, but very popular because it appeals to the common man. Its easy, does not require any deeper digging .
I happened to be friends with a school and college juinor whose father was the then CBI director. There is this common thinking that CBI Chief would be such and such person, but he was very regular person and very honest. ( His father went on to be a Governor )
Also, a clerk level thinking is that a CBI director would make lot of money ( because constables / inspectors / SHOs make money ) , but the truth is far from it. Just because a CBI inspector may take bribe does not mean the DCBI would end up getting a "cut". People don't do that. He had a simple, but elegant house in a very posh area - govt accomodation that comes with the job.
Remember that the world is not as motivated by profit or money as it is by ideology or thinking. I can tell you the audience here that not a single coaching among the top 3-5 coachings would ever pay money to a topper to say something.
Toppers are like you, and even if right now you think, that for money you will do something like this, trust me you wont do it when the time comes. At best you may work at coachings and you may get paid for it. But that has been happening since ages!
And people dont take money / or gifts to promote someone. At best, if they get a gift, they may be asked by a smaller coaching usually not to take the name of any coaching which they had actually taken up.
Also when inthis video,the popular idea that is floated is that Toppers take money to say they did answer writing from Day 1, trust me there is no truth at all in it.
But you will have to dig deeper.
Let us wind the clock a decade back.
Since 2011, the Commission started reforms. There were huge protests for CSAT when it was introduced all of a sudden in 2011.
Then 2013 changes came is GS paper and now we had 4 papers instead of two.
Limites space writing and all that.
There was huge uproar. The govt then was a lot more democratic and actually gave platforms to students to raise their voices.
The UPSC was under tremendous pressure and the papers that came were on the easier side.
If you see 2012 -2016 papers, the questions were fairly straightforward and were actually asked from the mains news that were doing the rounds!
That was also the time when several dotcom websites came up with answer writing initiatives to cater to the directly asked questions.
Papers were current oriented and hence no foundation was needed so much. You could actually do answer writing on the internet and expect a lot of questions to come from there!
And they did!
It was because of this reasons that answer writing became a rage - it was no propaganda by websites or coachings or toppers. People actually did that.
And when paper turned to more analytical, or foundation level things - people who had spent doing coaching benefitted more.
Which is why you will find that toppers from that era vouch for current affairs like anything. They were not paid to promote answer writing.
They did answer writing.
In fact, everyone did!
And it helped too.
However, ideas such as floated above, are easy to understand, make immediate sense. Imagining the world to be a thief , scheming liars makes our life's woes easier to understand.
My point of writing all this at 12:45AM is because I believe that this forum is ( and can be ) a small community ofmainstreamaspirants who write the prelims, mains, interview and have the right perception of the exam, as opposed to the youtube crowd which has a completely different thinking about the exam.
We are a more aware crowd here, and some of us actually clear prelims, some of us actually clear mains, some of us actually clear in the final list. We are not an ignorant community. The world is a rational place.
Look , we all think while preparing that we are "the" ias aspirants ( and ias aspirants are like us ). But the pool of aspirants as well as people who clear the exam is very vast very varied. The exam caters to all.
It is not the best exam. It is not even an ideal one. But this is what we have.
And it is natural to be pessimistic on days when it is not our day.
I apologise in advance to people who may be offended by my post, but please be assured that it is not my intention to offend anyone. The only purpose is to not end up with nihilism - nothing exists, nothing is true, and nothing can be done.
@Neyawn I have been associated with this forum for long. I attach importance to your views. I am also an avid reader of your blog posts. I find many of your insights quite useful.I also marvel at the brilliance of many active forum members. As for my candidature, I have qualified mains twice. This year I skipped. I will be appearing for the 2021-2022 cycle. Here I present two cases for you to consider in an impassioned manner. The first case pertains to a candidate who is a Stephen's graduate, the economics topper of Delhi School of Economics. He also worked with RBI governor as a researcher. He has topped IES recently. But he has not qualified CSE mains even once in his 5 attempts. The second case pertains to a handicapped candidate who can neither make nor comprehend a complex English sentence. He wrote CSE in vernacular medium, and opted for vernacular literature. He emerged topper of CSE mains written. If knowledge, conceptual understanding and communication skill had been the sole strength to get through CSE, the former would have got an interview call at least and the latter would have found it difficult to qualify for interview, let alone securing the highest score.
Thank you so much for accepting it in the right spirit and having this debate.
Who should clear the exam?
Depends on who you are asking.
Ask the English Speaking convent educated , engineer or elite college kid, or a tech worker and he will say it is the english-speaking-convent-educated-engineer-or-top-college guy-or-a-tech-worker who will / ( and should get a top rank ).
Or ask the not-so-smart-cant-speak-fluent-english person from rural Andhra who should top the exam,he will say that it is people like them, who know the ground reality, who have lived in villages and who were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth , that should top the exam.
The truth is, both of them can top this exam.
Look, I first had change of view / opinion about this exam, when some close friends asked me to take a session on Interview prep and why some people were getting less marks.
I had given some of them my Philosophy notes and I asked them if they will attend if I speak. They said yes, so there were a lot of friends, and people who knew me from the forum.
Until that day, I always believed. and had opinions about "the kind of people who should clear the exam".
It was a great meet, because I think from a single audience of 60-70 people - all from the forum, we were having all massive failures - all the people who had screwed up their interview – we would more than 20 people in Top 100 ranks – partially because that kind of crowd was attracted to such talks.
There was one kid - tall and handsome - like 6 feet tall, who very well looked like he would make a good cop said - Sir , I am already in IPS but i dont like uniformed services as I dont have that kind of personality, so I am filling IRS this year after IAS, what should I say if the board asks why you are leaving IPS for IRS.
We all laughed, because he was the most unlikely person to ask that question.
And then there was her
A lady with a kid. In a classroom of bachelours ( mostly ). She raised her hand and asked a question - Sir I have filled IRS after IAS. Sir, how can we ladies run like men and train like men. 'Woh Sab Naukri Gents log ke liye hi theek hai, Hum Ladies log ke liye to IAS - IRS hi theek hai.
The ways she said it, with innocence the class laughed. Partly because young engineers who speak good english always think that young engineers with good English would and should make best ias officers and should be the topper. Where is the space for ladies who cant run or jog?
I could see that she took a bike to reach HUDA Metro, then took the blue line and came to Karol Bagh.
I didnt see her for a year, until the next year, I was forming groups for HR state people. One of the people from HR , already in Allied service, i lined up with her.
Unfortunately, The group broke and few days later she said - Sir I found another girl from HR. She is also married candidate and profile is like me. Her name is Anu. We are preparing pretty well together.
The rest is history.
I can tell you that there was a certain spark to her, which was unmistakeable. It was impossible to NOT see and appreciate that spark.
This year I met someone smart again.
In fact, this year there was one kid, a super smart one, whom when I asked have you spoken to a mentor, his exact lines were - no I think I am yet to implement what the evaluator has asked me to.
I was a little surprised because most people generally complain that they are unable to interpret what the evaluator expects of them.
When he got Rank 21, I shared his story on my FB. And tagged two smart forum members ( crazyphoton and kabira ) , because I felt that this kid was kinda ahead of the curve - by which I mean he is sharp and smart and which may be compensated for by lack of social skills ( almost all of us wil have some weaknesses and strengths ) .
I posted this on FB
You can see other people comment.
I was a little concerned that he would be trolled on the Internet because of making the exam look very effortless, but the point is that he did say that he had never worked so hard in his life, not for other entrance exams, not for JEE.
He was also a little grateful.
I did watch his video a couple of times.
Now I am a person always looking for answers. Like who will make it ( in life ) and who wont and why? Is coaching necessary and for whom? What does it take to crack IAS in one go? What are the things coachings do wrong? How can they be made right?
What are the *final* answers to such questions?
So when I watched his video a few times, I wasn’t satisfied, and I pinged another student of mine, who had like slogged for a year “like a donkey” in his / her words before she got rank in 30s.
I asked her this question. - You slogged for like a year making your whole prep coaching centred, using coaching material like crazy and what not. He has done without much coaching ( apart from MGP )
She said something that added a very new perspective to my thoughts. She said.
They say - Sir, I think *everyone* does at least this much. This is bare minimum.
And I would reply - "No, Mr X. Hearing that you did "nothing" for essay at least a few thousand people will actually do nothing.And for you nothing means 6-8 tests + 70 pages of thematic notes + quotations + anecdotes but for some people nothing actually means nothing."
Look, we all want our clones to clear the exam. Some of us may have ideological frustrations with the overall selection criteria of the commission that some of us might even quit writing the exam, and thats an individual choice, but in no way can we say that it is the right thing or the only thing.
In my previous post, I have said about two people whom at some point I said - why waste youth and parents money, you see how one of them after clearing the exam texted back - You never thought I could clear the exam ( I didnt , I knew he / she would eventually crack ! )
We are not the ones given to decide who should be selected and who should not be selected. The only things we have in our hands are what we can do with the time that is given to us.
We have no rights and the world is not designed to give us what we want. Nor is the world designed to appeal to our rationality. You could be a global leader in Human Rights and democracy and your whole population one day would end up voting for trump who would lay seize to Capitol Hill and wipe out hundreds of years of democrartic and liberal credentials you have built and championed. The world isnt designed to be fair.
And if you want something that badly, you will have to up your risks and go for it even if there are chances of failure.
There is absolutely nothing in this world that does not come with risks. At least nothing worth having.
And for those of you expecting lot of fairness, i would urge you to read this kick - arse article by Oliver Emberton.
It was my last attempt an yud I failed. I have pushed down all that pain and not felt it. I am high and it is leaking a bit through my face. I don't know what do now. I have now where to go. I need a dream and I have none.
I don't wanna go in detail but I've lost everything during this journey. I have no where to shout except here.
You need to take a break. Inbox me.
O man, Trailer is interesting, but don’t think it will match the Kota factory level.
This isn’t looking as real as it could get :(
Maybe because we needed a less popular face in the lead. Hope it turns out to be great though.
O man, Trailer is interesting, but don’t think it will match the Kota factory level.
This isn’t looking as real as it could get :(
Maybe because we needed a less popular face in the lead. Hope it turns out to be great though.
I mean that’s not even how peoplelookduring the prep days.
Unless you have won the genetic lottery .
By a huge margin.
This will be very useful. Because MP does tell the whole thing like a story, and it makes for good foundation. Just that it takes time. But once you do it, you know things like a pro. I may have deleted my comment because I thought me stepping in sometimes stalls the good conversation which is not at all the intention :)
I love the book myself. They are my favourite apart from a ten year collection of Economic Surveys :)
This will be very useful. Because MP does tell the whole thing like a story, and it makes for good foundation. Just that it takes time. But once you do it, you know things like a pro. I may have deleted my comment because I thought me stepping in sometimes stalls the good conversation which is not at all the intention :)
I love the book myself. They are my favourite apart from a ten year collection of Economic Surveys :)
@Neyawn.Please comment on the ongoing discussion.
I seem to have done everything different to everyone else.
Do you know anyone who cleared exam with this approach
Thank you for the encouragement :) Sometimes I feel like a Neanderthal on the forum itself :)
P.S. I am happy that you did admit that you revised like crazy. Some people would be following you advice . When we are an aspirant, we have an aspirant bias - that is - we assume that everyone know and reads as much as we do - without knowing that a lot of people will mix and match five advices - taking the minimum from each - and don’t write answer , test series because you said , won’t revise because some topper said he didn’t get the time , won’t do basic books because they read somewhere that I didn’t get time to do basic books and only solved test papers ( some people do that ) and ends up doing nothing .
Then when you clear the exam, what gets highlighted in a popular video that you did nothing and yet cleared , without highlighting the replacement things you did :P
Also, I met an old man seeking guidance from him over my own career. I told him I am creative, innovating :P bit bad at routine work and fare badly on x,y,z parameters ( which are important for success in any way of life ) and I said - yet I am managing to do fine - he said - you are doing fine not because of the bad qualities of not doing routine work or having x,y, a but despite it .
A year later when I read a book - what got you here won’t get you there - I saw the same principles repeat, so stay a little cautious.
Maybe this is not the right thread to ask this question. But, programmer in me (farzi though :p) is very curious to know the algorithm used by Forum developers to rank the threads.
My intuition says - if the thread has high engagement rate - comments/likes (like this one), rank it higher. If trusted community members or forum staff created the thread, give it plus score. The last recent comments on thread will also have some score but not high enough to make it at top straight away.
@Neyawnsir, want to throw some light or is it a secretlike google's page rank algorithm ?
Lol,
it’s simpler than that, though Now I am thinking …
Always.
You know why? Because these are the people you will see in the coming lists.
in hindsight, getting rid of old forum to make room for fresh people and fresh ideas was worth it. We don’t want many people. We just want relevant people.
And I can tell you that toppers will be born just because of the right kind of environment.
What's wrong with forum dialog box for typing. When you change the line after pressing 4-5 enter keys, it recognise that as one single line break. While, using single enter press isn't even recognised. Text is continued in the same line.
Not only in essay.I did this this in all gs papers and even optional.0 answers written.
Even in pre I wrote 0 pre tests.
I had decided f**k all coachings,all toppers advises as they led to my downfall in last attempt.
I decided I would write whatever I feel in whatever way I feel in the exam in all the 7 papers and even in pre.
Thanks to rishab pant and his coach.
Dekho kya hota hai.
Bhai, for all the good suggestions that you have given, I feel compelled to point out some problematic ones as well. I do this not to discredit your hard work or even your strategy, as you said, we don't know yet. You might end up with a single digit rank or even outside the merit list. Although, probability is in favor of the latter for each interview appearing candidate :) But I really wish that you achieve the former :) Your hard work of making hand written notes, mugging them and going through these long committee reports must've helped in scoring big in mains.
I am doing this for other aspirants who are reading this thread. 2k views and hardly 30 contributors, so in the interest of this silent audience. The claim is not really accurate of writing 0 test, 0 essays, 0 answers. I understand that perhaps you are referring to not writing any test series. But, but, we have to be very careful with our words. You already had experience of one mains. Mains 2019. Which I am sure you must have analyzed and learnt from your past mistakes. This is important to highlight.
So, for others who are reading this, guys, it is not advisable to venture unprepared into mains examination. You don't compulsorily need to write any xyz coaching test series ofcourse :) But one must be well versed with UPSC PYQs and better get your answers verified by someone experienced. Just to know that you are on the right track.
Also, I want to highlight what Rishabh Pant said recently in a post match - "With experience I have learnt that there is nothing called as play your natural game. One needs to play according to the situation."
Practice is important to know how to react in different situations. Also Sunny might have done his struggles to reach the right sources, but following a test series can help a beginner in course correction in terms of targeting one's energy especially when there is abundance of coaching material, toppers, their strategies, their material, their notes, every year.
Nevertheless, his advices are really valuable. Originality is rewarded big time (experienced this myself) ; revision should be one's utmost priority ; some things you have to mug up, no alternative to this exists ; Intro and conclusion if prepared in advance for broader topics will help in saving crucial appox 15 mins in each paper.
Cheers@SunnyParashar just wanted to give a clearer picture of what I understood that you wanted to convey.
I appreciate your understanding of the exam.
But I am still confident to stick to my approach till marksheet comes.
Here everybody is assuming(including@Neyawn ) that I won't be in 338 odd students in the final list.
I would be happy to prove everyone wrong.
I still reteirate my words that mugging and internalising is the most important part of the exam even if one directly write answers in paper without prior experience as making so many notes does amount to answer writing.
I have written 0 tests,0 essays and my writing style is same as that of 2019 mains.Only difference I did is writing intro and conclu.
People do advise to prepare ethics examples beforehand.I did'nt but still managed to put example in each question of part 1.
Agarwal jitendra murariral(this year rank 128) had scored 427 in 2018 and 435 in 2019 in GS without any prior experience of such things(known him,so followed him).
I guess doing everything different than everybody has its own downsides.
I would sound like a hollow vessel till now since I have no proof to back my claims.
Its better for me to leave this place and do everything different as I have been doing till now.
P.S- I was referring to rishab pant's coach advise of not following experts and get his bat swing back and not follow so called experts.
P.S- And I don't know why everyone has assumed I would perform poorly.I might do well also.Maybe,its understandable as if people start succeeding with this method i.e with 0 ans practise and 0 essay practise forumias and other coachings would have to shut shop.
P.S- I do hope to clear the exam as it would prove all the existing strategies wrong.
Time to leave this place for good.
My apologies if you felt that I think you won’t succeed. I don’t think so. Every year there are outliers who make it.
And even if anyone thinks so, on this platform or elsewhere no one has or should have the right to say so.
My point was that when you finally get a top rank, and give out your suggestions , lot of people will follow you, without your clarity and caliber.
You on the other hand will assume that everyone has the same clarity and caliber and will power as you. And while things may work for you, it may not work for the rest of us. And since when did this UPSC exam have “one best way” of cracking it ?
@SunnyParashar right from the start you're sounding cocky. With just the motive of proving your strategy is the best and with the imagination that everyone here who doesn't comply with your line of preparation is just fooling around. Almost everyone can agree, coachings aren't everything and some do try to take advantage out of vulnerable aspirants. But, according to me my friend, you're no better. Keep doing your hard work, let other's do their own way too. No one is here to prove anyone's strategy which is wrong or right.
Please avoid adjectives! Let’s close it here!
@Neyawn I have texted you something. Please check. :)
I am not sure why you dropped out so fast of the call. I had to prioritise the two kids because they had been pursuing for long and I was busy doing group mocks and what these two people wanted was not a group mock. I do not prioritise a rank holding candidate over other students, least of all a person I know from here.
And like this the thread completed 150 pages :)YAYY.
100 pages pe i would have said "that's sau awesome". Chance missed.
This feels like such an antiquated software no? Write anything on TG and you will have 100 comments easily. And if you write something stupid , you will have it sooner.
What makes this different however is that we get to explore the depth of peoples thoughts at forum, and that is kinda still wonderful in an age of fast paced social media.
Whether forum Red Book on environment is sufficient for pre and mains or only for pre. Or other sources are necessary to cover the environment part.
Safely go ahead with it, if you are comparing it with any other book available. For mains we need an issue based approach apart from the facts. So you will need to go over and above it. There is a reason why the book I called PT things.
Thanks for pointing out EPIC. Felt much better than vision monthly to be honest. I haven't read more than 3-4 monthlies in my whole preparation due to irrelevant and content overload. Also, layout isn't user-friendly. Eventually relied only on PT and Mains 365.
@Neyawn forum really have some really good initiatives. My friend took MGP test series and current affairs for 2020 and got a interview call was very much appreciative of it. Also, many questions came from the test series. Negative publicity of one coaching isn't my aim but just want people should know about better alternatives. Just how I came to know about EPIC today
While, having vision test series, questions there too felt a bit irrelevant as they were quite precise within a topic(just like secure initiative) and not generalistic.
Ssshhh.
If I had my way, I would still keep this a *secret* community for Civils Preparation. Also, lets not discuss coaching stuff here. Dont you think we have some great conversations happening here.
See the words "Just don't spread the word."
I dance with joy when I see so many brilliant people on one thread. Trust me on this, if we just maintain the level of discussion, you will again have like 7 out of Top 10 ranks from this community, not even the academy.
@Neyawn Wow ! Could you please tell as to how to access the old threads from 2013-14-15 etc.. some of them were pure gold !
We did have a data breach where we lost a bit of old content. Let me assure you that new kids on the block have much wiser things to say, if you are willing to hear. :)
As long as quality of discussions is maintained.!
Please avoid discussions on political and religious issues, even if they are important on this platform.
Please go thorugh this
https://support.forumias.com/forumias-community/
Also, this.
@root Mark the punctuations. They matter.
Please avoid discussions on political and religious issues, even if they are important, on this platform.
@AzadHindFauz @whatonly @SergioRamos @Villanelle @peterparker @nerdfighter @sjerngal @DHARNA @Patootie Please tell what sources did you follow for post independence history as syllabus is vague and question was asked only once in 2013.
The best source of Post Independence History remains Politics Since Independence. It is brilliant.
@AzadHindFauz @whatonly @SergioRamos @Villanelle @peterparker @nerdfighter @sjerngal @DHARNA @Patootie Please tell what sources did you follow for post independence history as syllabus is vague and question was asked only once in 2013.The best source of Post Independence History remains Politics Since Independence. It is brilliant.
By which I mean the NCERT book. Want a long form of that. Refer to Sriram Post Independence/ Its the longer version of the NCERT book.
Some suggestions regarding preparation of GS Paper II (Polity & IR) are needed.I gave my previous two mains by reading Vision Mains 365 and a little writing practice. My scores were 81 & 86 in Paper II.
I think i have reached plateau as far as vision mains 365 is concerned. This time i want to try something different, so far i am following issue based preparation as suggested by@Neyawn but it is so demanding (notes preparation & a lot of reading from different sources) plus it is not generating confidence as it should be (may be upcoming AWFG 2.0 could help).
So friends if you could give some valuable suggestions it would be highly appreciated.
Also upcoming attempt will be my last attempt. :(
But issu based preparation is the way to go. It took me a long time to realise this. Some of the best candidates who “predictably” get ranks ( as opposed to people who get ranks ) after strategising and all , have made crisp notes of issues.
I mean some people have cleared the exam just because of this. They earlier had the strategy of reading stuff end to end like we do for prelims.
But Mains requires you to answer only one question on a certain issue, so prepare accordingly.
People who have the habit of reading things back to back ( prelims hangover ) make tremendous progress once they switch the approach .
@Pureheart Have you tried by noting down just 5-7-9 things of each dimension on any issue ?
You can begin with that. If you have dearth of time, take up some classes if possible. It reduces the time taken to prepare.
Also please have an incremental approach . Don’t try to have perfect notes on Day zero.
Some suggestions regarding preparation of GS Paper II (Polity & IR) are needed.I gave my previous two mains by reading Vision Mains 365 and a little writing practice. My scores were 81 & 86 in Paper II.
I think i have reached plateau as far as vision mains 365 is concerned. This time i want to try something different, so far i am following issue based preparation as suggested by@Neyawn but it is so demanding (notes preparation & a lot of reading from different sources) plus it is not generating confidence as it should be (may be upcoming AWFG 2.0 could help).
So friends if you could give some valuable suggestions it would be highly appreciated.
Also upcoming attempt will be my last attempt. :(
But issu based preparation is the way to go. It took me a long time to realise this. Some of the best candidates who “predictably” get ranks ( as opposed to people who get ranks ) after strategising and all , have made crisp notes of issues.
I mean some people have cleared the exam just because of this. They earlier had the strategy of reading stuff end to end like we do for prelims.
But Mains requires you to answer only one question on a certain issue, so prepare accordingly.
People who have the habit of reading things back to back ( prelims hangover ) make tremendous progress once they switch the approach .
@Pureheart Have you tried by noting down just 5-7-9 things of each dimension on any issue ?
You can begin with that. If you have dearth of time, take up some classes if possible. It reduces the time taken to prepare.
Also please have an incremental approach . Don’t try to have perfect notes on Day zero.
@Neyawn sir, can you have a look at my issue based notes of any subject if they're fine? I consolidated GS notes during dec-feb period, just wanted a review since you've emphasized a lot regarding issue based notes.
Sure, you may share it here itself.
there are few best practices of issue based notes.
- They should be less than a page or so
- They should have some keywords/ facts
- They should be rough, and not pretty
- They should not have stuff that you already know and have internalised
- When in doubt focus on having 3/5/7 dimensions of the debate
Those of you have been asking about members from the community making it, the years 2017 was the last year from which we had at least a few active people from community making it to IAS. The years before, we had much larger number of people, like at least 30+ people in Top 50 from the community threads, or 6+ people out of Top 10.
Post that year, there was a complete breakdown, and wit the kind of brainstorming and discussions we have now, we should a lot of people emerge from these threads in the holy PDF.
@Steph_Curry I am not sure if you are in service, but I have just seen your name around on the forum and then this file
You are doing well and keep up the consistency. There are some very close friends of ours who are in this list and there more than 20+ people who are under 200 ranks (but have not got IAS.) , some of whom I may have forced to write the tests personally. I dont know if you are selected, but if you are not, if you consistently live up the competition, you will do very very well.
@Neyawn Can't express how much I appreciate the encouraging words, sir. I wrote mains this year but couldn't go through. Hoping for the best this time.Forgot that I wrote IFoS mains too. Results, for some reason not declared yet.
Give it your life man. There is no purpose to life other than the goal you are committed to. One of my favourite students is writing the test, and s/he had a good under 80 ranks in Civils last year. And I see how. He is “effortlessly” managing a good rank.
But honestly, it takes a lot of effort to look effortless.
I have few queries regarding Mains preparation and overall preparation in general
1. Have given 4 prelims till now, couldn't clear, missed by 1-2 marks in last two attempts. I am working now, and doing well financially as well. But the dream to become a civil servant is still there and hence mustered the courage to give one more attempt. Prelims has become a huge mental block for me, I am not sure how to go about it. I was doing good preparation keeping May 31st in mind, but suddenly this delay of 3.5 months has again got me into a fix.
How should I go about the preparation now, should I focus on prelims and mains simultaneously or should I do optional now, this conundrum about formulating an ideal preparation strategy is taking a toll on me. It's making me very anxious everyday. I think about equal weightage to Prelims, Optional and little bit Mains, but again it becomes too much in a day. If I do only optional, then the thought of 4 failed prelims mocks at me.
A brief background - I started my prep in 2016 quitting job as a business analyst. Failed in 2017 prelims, immediately realized UPSC is very uncertain and wrote other exams - IRDAI and NABARD and others. Presently working at IRDAI (Since 2018 Jan). Got married in 2018, we had a beautiful baby in 2020 and life is a bliss now.
Sometimes I wonder why am I preparing for this stupid exam, and then I feel it's really worth it, I should give one more shot. I wish, I should have been blissfully unaware of this exam like I was till 2015-16. I was 25 then and happily working in a corporate job with good onsite opportunities.
Even last year, when prelims got postponed, I was very relieved. Thought I will do optional thoroughly, prepare for mains and then at the end of day, didn't clear prelims itself. Last year after prelims debacle, I enrolled in a CA program of levelup IAS and been following them regularly.
Anyone in similar situation - How to get rid of this prelims blockage from mind, what to do for mains ideally.
Congratulations on being gifted with a baby :)
Is it a boy or a girl?
As a thumb rule, if you have not cleared Prelims three times in a row, 99% chances are that you will not clear it the fourth time, unless you have donesomethingradical about it . ( Or unless you have done at least CA, and you get a CA wala paper ).
Identify the known bottlenecks. There are four major reasons why people dont clear Prelims 3+ times.
#1 They think they have read basic books, but they havent. Basic books are to be read, chewed and digested. No questions can be gotten wrong from them.
#2 They have an obsession of Optional Subject. I annually see people take up PSIR Test Series and crash course and studying it 2 -3 months before the Mains. If 2 months before thePrelims, you are doing anything else except Prelims, you are a risk taker. Risk takers come in two varieties - and one of them are the reckless ones, who dont calculate risks, and fail, and the probability of failure was 100% for any third observer execept the risk-taker who simply is not aware of it.
#3 They fail to understand that competitive examination requires revision. How many times? As many times as you can. A good number for revision is 5-7-9 times. Its not college exam. Keep sources minimum and revisions maximum. Most of the times candidates I have met say that "I have read the book" but can't answer questions from there. If you say you have read a book, you should answer any questions from there. The good news is that it is not only possible, but actually easy once you set the goal of maximum revisions.
#4 Taking Guidance from a senior / or being demotivated by a senior who has not cleared Prelims. This can be fatal. The Civils exam makes you wiser by all means.
But flunking prelims gives youverywrong notions about the exam. I means its terrible. The people who have written even one Mains vs people who have written 0 mains have very different perception of the exam. Failure is a great teacher, but Prelims failure more often that not teaches you some very wrong lessons.
My suggestion to you would be that with all might focus on clearing prelims. You may do Mains stuff till 2 weeks of July at max - and there also please do GS. Dont be seduced by Optional. Toppers / Interview Appeared students who tell you to do Optional. They may tell you to do optional because they cannot bring themselves down to your position, and give you the suggestions fromtheirperspective.
Last but not the least, listen to all people, but follow only one, or best is to follow yourself. Onlyyouexactly know your true position. Not even your spouse. In fact least of all the spouse.
Remember that while other people may be the reasons for the screw ups in your life, but the responsibility to clean up the mess is exclusively yours. In the end take a good decision.
And there are no good or bad decisions, for that matter. Decisions have to be made good by dint of hard work.
Decisions are good or bad in the hindsight.
Also, please do not be offended if this sounds rude, but paucity of time forbids me from sprinkling niceties after every sentence. Also, kindly know that we /community people have your best interest in mind when we / community members are offering you an advice - as per our understanding of your situation.
Does anyone know which agriculture document@Neyawnsir was talking about in the 40 days video?
Hello,
That was probably the Red Book for Agriculture the team has been working on. It should be on the Epic Channel. It is usually a foundation material.
Let me look it up for you.
Have managed to solve some problems for beginner in the guides below
- Indian Polity - Summary for QR -https://blog.forumias.com/polity
- Economy Basics - Summary for QR -https://blog.forumias.com/eco
@AJ_ Omg top 20 congratulations. I don't know you personally but I am so so happy for you. P.S. I have never talked to an IAS before so kind of fangirling right now😁
Haha, You will be surprised to see that this community will have more IAS officers than any other place.
And toppers are among us, who slogged, and got their timing right !
All, Please post your ranks here
https://forumias.com/post/detail/CSE-20202-Results-outShare-ranks-joy-happiness-sadness--1632489845
