https://www.newindianexpress.com/states/kerala/2020/jul/16/amid-spurt-in-covid-19-cases-over-one-lakh-students-in-kerala-appear-for-keam-entrance-exam-2170517.html
The exam will be on time. Several exams, such as the one above, shall have been conducted by then. Please focus on studies instead of speculating here. If it is indeed postponed, which seems unlikely now, we can adjust preparation accordingly.
@Rambo93 I'm aware of this. Please note that social distancing has gone for a toss everywhere. The point is that policymakers and people seem comfortable with the way things are. Exams will happen. Dates can move here and there but I doubt in the case of our prelims they will shift further. Anyway, it's a personal call to tailor one's strategy accordingly.
@Constant Commission can follow the lead of JEE and NEET. Even if Commission postpones, Commission will have to grapple with same issues few months down the line. The Commission may be full of babus but it is likely to have at least this foresight. Let's prepare as if the Commission is conducting it on time, and if the Commission wavers, we can count on it to make our lives hell later. 🤫
@HotBloodPrince haha yeah!
@HotBloodPrince haha yeah, though in her defence GA's GS marks weren't the top of the lot that year. She had philosophy optional, and appeared for the interview I think.
@Tangent this b praak thingy is major cringe. What hole have these services dug themselves into!
@pizzza not every work of art is equal, most people have different tastes of course, and they are free to express their opinions of art work based on that taste. The question of 'who are you to decide' leads nowhere. Being a good human has nothing to do with keeping quiet or faking appreciation for something you don't really hold in high regard. As for the question of civil servants indulging in art, by all means. Upamanyu Chatterjee wrote some fine books while in service. To each their own, including their judgements.
@pizzza the thing is you don't have to respect my opinion, that's the whole point. Anyway, all is well.
@PhoenixD you're dead right, I desisted from commenting but I'm a resident of one the districts he was posted in. Let's just say that this balloon can burst any time.
@Tyler Durden yeah, my guess is they may push it to December max, if they don't manage October but try they will.
@Chanakya that break went on for a tad too long imo!
@FinalMission UPSC doesn't give or take attempts, the goverment does. Today the Karnatak HC did repeatedly ask if there is a plan to conduct exam again for those who may miss it, though they later let it proceed. Extra attempt is a genuine demand imo, at least for those who can't take the exam. Perhaps one extra for everyone may be granted if govt has any sense.
PMFJI but this could be a little more illuminating if you guys gave your precise ideas on what mix of policies you'd prefer, for, I assume, none of you is for unfettered capitalism or for good ole communism. Let's not lock horns over mere words like socialism, these have meanings all over the place.
@cat It's not just contempt but also jealousy in many a case. That said, the so called fat cats in the Indian system are there for they are good at manipulating policy. But I admit, there's something noble and moral about the small capitalist, the freedom of being on one's own is sweet.
@vision2020 True, capitalism also tends to ossify the topmost layer, but that's at least a problem solvable without bringing down the edifice. Going against the Politburo on the other hand...Anyone with intellectual integrity who also has romantic notions about the Soviet Union may read The Gulag Archipelago, or at least a summary thereof.
@ranahere999 imo PPP will end up a mess again, state should stay in a sector, if at all, and compete with purely private entities. This marriage of convenience called PPP is neither here nor there, and rife for all sorts of manipulation. Govt should get out of airlines and hotels and focus some on drinking water at the distant village.
@redemption My dear fellow is it your claim that the empire of evil (USA) is worse than the civilization of honey (China)? Pointing out moral failings in opponents to discredit an argument is an old trick, but it doesn't work. If Hitler says the sun rises in the East, he's still correct. Now the Uighur question isn't as clear as the sun rising of course but in these matters we shall never see it live, until we do, and it is too late. There's enough evidence of Chinese mischief there, including in several UN reports. But, of course, they're all neoliberal shills conspiring against the well meaning wise men toiling away in the Standing Committee?
@redemption I trust you didn't care for my point about identity of the person making an argument being irrelevant. Also, I didn't say concentration camps so that gratuitous questionnaire you penned is irrelevant. Since you asked, there are reports by Patrick Poon, Amnesty, yada yada. You'd be glad to know even comrade Chomsky has appended his name to one of the letters that he keeps appending his name to, which deal with the Uighur crisis. There are of course accounts by Uighurs who live outside China but who have family being tormented there, not one account but many, one only has to look. What has the trilateral commission got to do with this? Are we balancing my evils vs your evil, shall we reel off names irrelevant to the Uighur issue? Milosevic, Mugabe, both supported by the CCP while they were useful, etc. etc. but what's the point! Please remember that the anti terror bogey being used by CCP against the Uighurs is the same that is used by all tyrants elsewhere too, including in India now. That's not to say there isn't Islamic terror, there is, and certainly in Xinjiang, but it's being exploited for political ends too.
@Lemillion 'Sen and Bhagwati' has been wrung dry by the UPSC aspirants over the years, time to give the old ghosts some rest I'd say. Tum ye batao exam hoga ki nahin?
@Lemillion Thanks for this man! Immunological dark matter is worthy of spending some time on now!
@redemption umm okay, I won't wade into the Kashmir matter for the night is precious, so that keeps my boat afloat. Good day!
@redemption Interesting bit on Hayek... I quite admire his intellect. If possible, please share a link or reference for the assertion made, I'd like to read. Here or DM, thanks.
@redemption What? You comprehended that as Hayek saying non white lives don't matter? Here Hayek is reflecting on the problem of choice and initital conditions by relating the offers he had from several nations for the upkeep of his children were he to perish in the Nazi bombings in London. He argues that the choice for a man his age with social connections is going to be different from the choice he'd make for his children. (Europe I guess vs USA), And then adds that in conducting this thought experiment he has assumed his children would be brought up by a white family than a black one. If anything that bracketed revelation of assumptions shows that he clearly understood that life chances are not the same for a white and a non white child in the US!!
Anyway, it is not a good strategy to pummel your head with ideological ideas so early on in life, for everything will then seem impure by your acid tests of morality. Hayek for instance was quite in favour of some govt intervention, including healthcare etc. but ideologues paint him otherwise.
I don't know what a 'guy of science' is.
@Chanakya Kautilya sahab aapke vicharon ka postmodern analysis na ho jae yahan, Bach ke!
@redemption It's not enough to throw around buzzwords like 'intellectual dishonesty'. I've clearly explained what Hayek has said and not what your author has interpreted(although even that is quite different from what you've been saying). Also, you very emphatically said in an earlier comment that Hayek believed non white lives matter less, which is what piqued my interest. You have now moved on to forgetting inequality, and elite, etc. Please read the Hayek Rawls relation in some more detail.
@redemption There you go again, you won't get it will you that trying to paint someone opposing your contention in an immoral light by imagining what they may or may not do and then proceeding to smuggle in a real point won't wash here. Did I say caste inequalities don't need to be checked at all? Let's assume that is what Hayek said for the sake of argument. How does it follow that he said what you earlier claimed he did. What you claimed was a fact, that turned out to be well, a fake fact. Now you're logically extending the domain into the implications of that fact by delving into EWS caste upsc etc. I won't take the bait sir. Read the original, then come back with some better understanding bereft of red herrings and name calling.
@redemption You may refrain from posting again, I read it the first time. You seem to be claiming that (as per the author) Hayek suggested it won't be practical in many cases to undo by special preferential laws that what has been done over centuries through unjust means, he implicitly means black lives don't matter. Or that they matter less than white ones. But that's not logical. He's arguing against the universal applicability of special treatment not making a moral claim against the black race. By your token he's against women, lgbt, even the general poor and the wretched, the dolphin in the Atlantic etc.
For all I know he may be a racist, but I'd like to see a good logical argument made for that loose claim flung in one small corner of the internet. Since you're also into judging an argument by its presenter, what is it the book that you're reading?
@redemption Hahahahah! That's sort of cute because you have your heart in the right place and argue with an infectious passion. Trust me, I'm no fan of the fellow you refer to here.
Coming back to Hayek, the argument he's making here is about the 'calculus of life'. Please go back to the first line of the paragraph you have truncated. He does begin by prefacing the warning that whether we like to face it or not we have to often think along these lines. This is what the world is. Then he gives the example of triage (Hardin) , a somewhat fancy term for the choice a doctor faces in a war about whom to treat first (as some may die while others survive). It is in this context that he has discussed the notion of 'evolution'. Surely, you agree we make these claculations all the time. Whom to rescue first at the time of a disaster? If you have just one kidney available to lend(for friends never return what is lent), but two friends on the deathbed waiting for it, you make a choice.
Please don't draw a straight line from this to He who must not be named. All the best!
@redemption I'm aware of this, and yes I do need to read much more, on everything really. The longer we live, the more we learn. But I was quite surprised by your earlier claim regarding the white lives thingy. Anyway, good day now, I must call it a day.
@redemption We may have to do it , at least policymakers do. Nature of course plays its own games. I guess being an utopian is heady and recommended, enjoy it while you can, old fogeys like me have had their utopianism cut and shredded.
@Kira0705 Congrats, weren't you there on the old forum too? Anyway, well deserved! Do share some unconventional wisdom when you get the time for it.
@vision2020 last attempt, English lit, sociology throughout though
@vision2020 all the best to you and everyone else too, once the exam comes nearer all will be focused and we shall overcome.
@curiouscse True, bar an even more extraordinary situation, the exam shall be on time. Those in denial should either skip it or risk wasting time over idle speculation. They may consider giving an extra attempt perhaps, but exams are on now.
@Johnny_Distracted most places now have operational buses within the state. Those in containment will be allowed to leave. Also, even if the buses are not available now, the NDA exam will show up that weakness, if at all. Prelims is well placed post nda jee etc. By that time schools may also have opened up. These things have to be decided on balance, there is no perfect solution, how long shall they wait? And what's to say that the numbers will come down by December or even March? Yes, an extra attempt would be the moral thing to do here for all exams, but they will be conducted.
@Johnny_Distracted While the situation is serious, please note that these numbers will keep coming down as testing increases, it is not that fatal a virus. The young are in fact least likely to die of it. In a messy situation this is what UPSC can do. Of course if the state governments categorically reject any chance of conducting exam it will have to be postponed but there's no chance of that happening imo. The streets have been back to life since May, the initial overreaction and panic is largely dead and buried.
@Tejas14 True, those who don't want to take the risk can skip it. The risk will likely remain same or worsen later on too.
@Johnny_Distracted I've been around here more than you'd guess. Nothing of the sort will happen. Even if they sue, there shall be no remedy in the nature of postponing or cancelling exam. Attempt may be given. Perhaps you are too soft or the world is too brutal, but that's how it works. 'lol'
@Thanos_ no, doesn't work that way, extra attempt is messy business, has to be increased for everyone along with age relaxation. Unless they want to keep an option in the form for many years about those who had enrolled in 2020. As far as impact is concerned it is same for all, so last attempt folks can't be singled out for benefit .
@Ju_e_Sheer The standard of the UPSC exam has seriously gone to the dogs, but hey, put up with it! What else can we do!
@Thanos_ true, most likely, but politicians may push it if they see a demand. Unlikely still.
@Rudra12 They generally don't go against constitutional bodies so easily. Past cases related to UPSC are evidence, and frankly this is an executive decision, shall be left to the sarkaar.
@sankalpr91 insights is wrong. In simple terms fyp1: agri, fyp2: cap goods. (aka heavy industry). Import substitution policy was 1956 or 55 I think, so that checks out.
@sankalpr91 You are correct about the grammar but this is UPSC, chalta hai
@Rudra12 Nobody here is demanding an exam, but when reality is in your face you must accept it. Unnecessary speculation by those who are anyway distracted will draw in many others here, and perhaps affect their studies. No one wants to look like a fool when exam happens on d day and they end up unprepared because they were hoping for a postponement until the previous night. Just get on with it guys, number of cases will keep going up, most of us will get it, there'll be no let up even later so govt won't stop. As far as deaths are concerned, callous as it may sound, we have far more people dying each day in a normal year than from covid alone in a day this year. Anyway, analysis is not the point. If someone feels strongly they may go to the court and sacrifice the attempt doing so!
@Subramanyam yes it is secondary. But the question asked "due to". Don't overthink with upsc. It's a terrible pain to realise that one lost marks because they couldn't make an objective question in an objective paper. But that's how it will be this year too for some questions.
@Rudra12 Of course, people will have to lead their lives, especially when there's no end in sight. The golgappawala also has to earn. At least in Delhi the streets are buzzing, certainly not as in Feb but good enough. The argument against the exam cannot be of the pandemic as by the time prelims is conducted several such exams shall have been done. The only real hassle is transport, which I guess UPSC and sarkaar have decided to brazen out. Best course is to study for the 4th and then some more.
Vaccines are not a joke. This vaccine will first need proper WHO approval, then be accepted by the country, and then be licensed for production here, and then administered gradually per priority, a topic for gs4 in itself. Certainly those sitting for becoming babus are not a priority. Don't have hopes on vaccine for postponement. If there's any postponement it should be for legitimate problem of lack of easy transport. Failing which an extra attempt should be granted. But please try to prepare keeping 4th in mind.
@Phagocyte Take care you, I've seen your posts in the telegram too. Yes, extra attempt is the moral thing to do, but of course don't bank on it. Kaam karte chalo!
@Katy_Singh start from Jan, will help in making educated guesses
@Shubz Well put. Those selling snake oil in the name of postponement are a dime a dozen here. I remember a SC hearing the day before a prelims some years ago! Anyone appearing should forget everything else save studies. If there is any postponement it will be known, good luck.
Courts won't get into the feasibility of conducting exams. At most, expect some homily on SOPs and advice for extra attempt. The advocate will make a good buck though. Exam won't be postponed, and even if it is, it shall be postponed for maybe a couple of months, not time enough for the stepping out anxieties of folks here to subside. People are already out on the streets for long; corona, for better or worse, has now been internalised. Individual outcomes may go south but government will decide on the aggregate imo, and just now it doesn't seem they are in a mood to postpone, much less merge or cancel as some seem to be suggesting. Study, study, study!
@Katy_Singh It will soon be realised they've been led up the garden path.
@Titan55 There can be no distinction on the basis of attempts, the guy who loses his first attempt to corona has incurred the same damage as the one who loses his sixth. Every attempt is important to an aspirant. Which is why they can only increase age and attempt for everyone, or else it gets too messy.
@Sherkhan1428 Exactly. This is the only valid reason for postponing the exam, everything else including safety etc. is a jumla as the country is already out. UPSC should think carefully and either increase centres, wait some time for transport, or with govt nod make do with an extra attempt.
@Rudra12 Haha. Btw he's making a good name by playing on anxieties of all manner of students, jee, neet, kcet, what not! The incredible thing is that people are so naive as to invoke the SC to interfere in a policy decision for a small matter such as the conduct of an exam some days hence. The fear of corona is gone, it shall have to be lived with. The world can't be shut down as the judge correctly observed, people also need to make a living. Best case prayer can be for an extra attempt and that too lies at the discretion of the executive. Prepare, prepare, prepare, disregard anybody who is projecting here their own anxiety of appearing as the possibility of postponement.
@curiouscse Haha I too think several here haven't stepped out at all in the last few months. Please close this thread now and may the deserving succeed!
@Spectrum haha, reminds me of an old thread on the older forumias.
@Sadhika 'woked up'. There's a ready stock response from the depths of the left: appropriation of value created by labour. To everyone on this thread, perhaps it's time to shut it down? The game is on right and proper now and 4th is the day.
Nahi hoga postpone. Sab mile hue hain jee. States could simply have said no and gotten ready for a confrontation. Now both they and the govt can hide behind the SC when it dismisses the petition. Of course puppet masters with deep pockets could be elsewhere. Please don't take this very seriously, I'm just a cynic.
The bottomline is that the exam is linked to a political economy of private colleges and coaching institutions too. Of course there's a legitimate case too for the exams as the country is anyway running so this apprehension is overblown. But transport is a major hassle and the reason why the govt is ignoring it is because of the political economy I mentioned. My guess. Basically, pad lo, ye exam lenge 4 Oct and Jan me mains. To minimize regret then, forget this now. It's a lost cause.
@Koro-Sensei Won't relate to exams, or at least to this cycle.
@Howzthejosh Hahaha some new jumla then
1. UPSC can only advise.
2. Any attempt is given by the government.
3. It is not possible to single out categories such as last attempters, covid warriors, etc. If attempt is given it will be given to all with corresponding age limit increase : 33/7 for UR.
4. The judges have only considered this flippantly so haven't really gone into the arguments around an extra attempt.
5. A shining example of how the Indian system works : push through to the extent you can. Every body only wishes to complete its documentary duty, such as writing to chief secretary, railway board lol.
6. Lawyers were very shitty. No specific details. They could have mentioned regions where no trains have run since March, there are several. In life, earn money and hire an outstanding lawyer. Judges take big ticket lawyers very seriously.
7. Please study for now. And remember that prelims is only partially about facts and months put in to prepare. On the day of the exam, the pitch changes for most. There are 100 questions, and each question has its answer written bang in front of your eyes. One has to let one's intuition take over for many questions, which is why a relaxed and cool mind is very very necessary. So, be good to yourself for the next 4 days. Self love!
All the best!
@Reborn2 This is exactly the reason why giving such differentiated attempts is messy. For instance, how will the UPSC know which aspirant was genuinely unable to attend due to Covid, will a positive report be asked of them, or will those who couldn't find transport also be considered, etc. Also there is still discrimination in this scheme, why should a person who doesn't have his last attempt this year not get an extra attempt, as the pandemic affects him too, and it isn't his fault that he hasn't exhausted five attempts already etc. He'd like to keep his attempts intact whatever their number may be. That is why 33/7 is required. But the ball is with the govt, not upsc. And we all know how that will go down.
@Reborn2 I get it. The 'concession' should be available to all. A fellow who has 2 left should also get the concession to write both in a pandemic free world, similar for a guy who has 3 left. And not all of them will have the luxury of deferring year without affecting attempts as they may have only as many years available as they have attempts. The only case in which this concession will be logical is when the rationale behind having six attempts in the first place is to deal with exigencies such as this pandemic. This has never been stated, except in this case by the ASG.
Yes, let the govt decide. I'd suggest those in a quandary to take the attempt this year itself. Govt. generally doesn't care.
@mehuifs They will not allow positive students whenever their status is known as positive guys are not supposed to move around. I think this has been made very clear by the court too. This is the whole basis of the attempt relaxation argument. The ASG tried to wing it by comparing it to a heart attack, where an aspirant can have no cause for relaxation but was promptly checked by the judge. This is a pandemic which is a public health issue, entire blame for it cannot shift to the sufferer, and some remedy must be found. But then, yahan sab chalta hai. I'd suggest last attempters and those with equal number of years and attempts to take the exam on the 4th. The positive ones can of course not do so, they should hope for relief from the govt.
@thepolicydreamer A very general reading and years wasted after this exam. Frankly, I don't have a ready answer for people starting prep or on earlier attempts. This is no exam worthy of its name.
@kartikeybhatt171778 Your inference is correct. This is a good example of the sort of thinking needed in the exam hall. Reading the Hindi version seals this question.
@mightyraju Relax, it will read the dark portion, which is A
@Phagocyte No. The option is incorrect.
@Raptor22 The case is void even if one exception is found. Anyway, please check the Hindi translation to clear any doubt.
@Raptor22 I understand what is confusing here. I got confused during the exam and went over to the Hindi section. I'm away from my paper but it had resolved all doubt. The central point is that eligibility to vote has nothing to do with ministership. Yes, I believe there is a time limit for filing grievances, please check.
One reason why cutoffs don't fall despite paper type and nature changing so radically is that the secret about attempting left right and centre in prelims was let out years ago. Many aspirants and most of the old ones play the guessing game now. For these few seats, a sizeable number is bound to get a windfall from guessing. This places a lower bound on the cutoff. It's insane, but what else should one expect from this overhyped exam.
@sarat_bose I thought so too in the exam, but this is UPSC, I remembered they don't think so much, and refrained from bubbling along those lines. It's a tragedy the way we must guess at the exam's focus : pure logic or accepted terminology in books. IMO with a year to make 100 questions, the examiners sure are a lazy indifferent bunch.
