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Why are Hindi medium selections so low?

Is it because of CSAT?? I was asking because one of my friends plans to write in Hindi medium was was concerned about this. Any ideas?

Also he was planning to join Drishti. Anyone has any idea on it too ?

CaptainVyom , syakh0789
5k views

9 comments

So I have been working with 4 students from Hindi medium for their Mains preparation. 

I have tried to analyze the issue from a structural point of view, and will not say that the coaching you have mentioned is good or bad. There is a rational reason behind things. If you would like to know about this, you can read my post on "Why roads in Bihar are poor?" and No, Corruption is not the answer. 

Anyway, so now all the four kids have appeared for the Interview. ( I hope they are not reading it ) . But what I have seen is ( because of my inherent desire to focus on missing links - which can produce a rank under say 20 or 50 - and while it does not work all the time - the guy you expect to get a rank under 20 may land up with IRS or some other allied services, it does work most of the times ), is that the students are forced to write and express them in a language which does not have contemporary vocabulary. 

Do not get me wrong. I have high respect for Hindi, for it is not only my mother tongue, but because what can be best expressed in Hindi - primarily - tales of the middle class struggle - cannot be expressed in English that well ( Unless you are Jhumpa Lahiri in the Namesake. )

Hindi words are created by Sandhi ( conjugation of Hindi words to give a new meaning ) . Now let us say you have to write a word federalism - a Hindi word exists for it, and it is fairly well established.

But as you use a word "cooperative federalism" or "bargaining federalism" , the meaning of federalism changes completely. Hindi words for these are sometimes difficult to frame, though they can be framed. In fact they exist. But here is the challenge.

I am aware that for people studying for 2-3 years, if they dont pick up and get a Mains call, they need significant content upgradation. Even if they have been preparing for five years. 

These 4 kids ask me to join CA classes of forumias ( which are conducted in English ) .

While I believe that it will help them, the concerned faculty thinks Hindi medium students may not benefit as he is completely from South and does not even use Hindi words to explain a concept.

Mains happens, I see them make improvements and I see they are able to integrate the class ideas in their answers.

When Mains result coes, It works for them, somehow they have all gotten an Interview call. Three of them were appearing for the Interview the first time.

When I asked One of them, who already had appeared for Interview before but did not make it to final list, He said he felt a big difference between what is taught in Hindi medium vs English medium.

But it is not just quality of teaching which is a factor.

For example, this year, the CA faculty will be working to ensure that new ideas are pushed in the class so that there is a significant change and addition in vocabulary and ideas for Mains 2020 so that the students are able to express themselves in less number of words. This is what has fetched marks for say under 50 ranks - which is crucial to get IAS and a good cadre. 

So, when he adds ideas like "infodemic", "motivated blindness towards X,Y,Z", "food-dominated-purchasing-power" , "surveillance state" , - these are already floating ideas and they are "self-explanatory". What does a Hindi medium candidate do?

It is true that he is allowed to write English words, but of course the 1st attempt of the student is to use a Hindi word, which not all students will be able to do in a limited time in exam conditions.

It is also true that these ideas can be expressed without using these phrases - such as infodemic - which is "there is so much rapid spread of misinformation", but the impact these two phrases have is completely different. 

There is Hindi Medium and English Medium Coaching. There is no Hindi Medium and English Medium Professor

Here I would like to admit that the examiner who is checking your copy who is a Lecturer of Professor is a Political Science Professor or a Geography Faculty or a Sociology Faculty - but he is not a Hindi Medium Sociology Faculty or a Hindi Medium Political Science Faculty.

A Faculty is a Faculty , he is not of Hindi medium or English medium faculty. People from North - who can read and write Hindi are the ones checking both English and Hindi copies. And when they see a candidate in English able to put ideas more accurately without content terrorism, he is awarded better marks.

Why is Hindi medium selection low? -

Mass Appeal Answer : Because Hindi coachings are bad.

Deeper Answer : Because of inability to compete with English medium in terms of expressing ideas.


CSAT is a reason for less selection of Hindi  

Mass Appeal Answer : Down with CSAT. Hindi medium people cant score 67 marks because they are not only poor with English but also with Maths.

Deeper Answer : Hindi language challenges of expressing ideas in limited space introduced at the time of CSAT. 

So Hindi medium students selection has reduced because of CSAT and that it has been a watershed moment in Hindi Selections - this is only a partial truth. I will add that Limited Space QCA Booklet introduction that has had a bigger impact.

I can explain this better, but some other time. 

Naadan_Parinda, GaryVee and 9 others like this
4.7k views

My Limited Understanding on why Hindi selection lower side:


1. Lack of quality coaches across subjects. Most of hindi mainstream coachings rides over single personality. Even this person is good "speaker" rather than good coach, given the fast changing nature of UPSC.


2. Lack of quality Newspaper, websites and coaching portals to disseminate the requisite content. CEC, Ex Governor, Prakash singh, Top economists, scientists , even ministers et al writes columns in leading English dailies - an understanding level which no other hindi editor can achieve.


3. Level of literary development in hindi is still very less especially in technical aspects. Foreign secy or RSTV big picture panel - all are mostly English speaking people. 


4. Paper in UPSC are made by English people mainly - later just translated in other languages. Biggest Flaw/gap in CSE.


5. Hindi aspirants remains FAR FAR AWAY from real levels of competition. Sorry to say but it's reality. Competition only can help improve further even the best of bests. Mass number is not competition. Quality of competition matters. Much better in English zones like ORN.


6. Most Hindi selected people are extremely dedicated and extra hard worker self studying people. Those who leave all excuses aside and integrate best of English side like TH / RSTV Content / Best coaching CA booklets or specific topics based study after analysing PYQs. But it demand patience and perseverance which often Hindi SOCIAL MEDIA VIDEOS PHOTOS inspired aspirants lack in initial years. (Sorry if it sound politically incorrect ! But I have known quite few Hindi selected and rejected people in my journey. )


7. A few deserving ones left behind bcz of CSAT. But same stands true for English people also. CSAT is a skill - much independent of language but ARTs Vs SCIENCE/ENGG Background dependent thing. As qualifying paper it don't impact much those who deserves selection in rest all aspects.


8. Humanities mein Optional subject mein performance also depends on Medium. Understanding of Weber in English is quite different than वेबर of Hindi. Books hi nhi h Hindi mein optionals ki us level ki naa us level ki coaching h jo interlinkages smjha ske contemporary. Upsc need that dynamic understanding for top scores. 


IRRESPECTIVE OF ALL THIS ANALYSIS, SELECTION IN HINDI MEDIUM WILL KEEP HAPPENING DEPENDING ON WHEN UPSC DECIDES TO CHANGE THE RATIO OF SELECTION OR HOW MANY REALLY GOOD-GUIDED SELF-STUDYING EXTRA-HARD WORKING INDIVIDUALS JOIN THE LEAGUE.


(#Apna_Number_Aaayegaaa ) 



Best Wishes Comrades. 👍💐

Naadan_Parinda, GaryVee and 4 others like this
4.5k views

Let us try to analyze the situation from the current perspective. Nowadays how many students from well to do families join Hindi medium schooling in the first place. I think hardly any. Given a chance, you would also like to put your ward in an English medium school.

Since these students are from deprived families many of them have to work and support their families. The base of knowledge starts to get weak and a gulf is already created in the early days of education between English medium and Hindi medium students which get widened as they progress to degree level. If these students later opt for civil preparation they have to work much harder and in many cases, they might not be able to cope up with the competition.

Now coming to students who don't belong to the above category but have taken Hindi medium because of some other reasons.

The UPSC exam is designed in English and then translated to Hindi so when you keep an English audience in mind then some problems may occur like the change of context of question like one topic in essay paper or translation of some questions. These have also some impact. But this a very minute reason.

One major factor is in writing the Hindi language itself because in English you can write without lifting your pen continuously but in Hindi after every word you have to put a bar. But no extra time is given. It doesn't matter much but somewhere down the line in this cut-throat competition these minor things may give an English medium candidate.

These points are in addition to the already mentioned above by Neyawn.

Other generic issues like lack of materials, good coaching etc. remain.

As far as Drishti is concerned in the field of Hindi it is doing good and since your friend might not have many options he may join it. Best for him would be watching some of their class lectures etc. from youtube and decide.



TwoFace,
4.4k views

My Limited Understanding on why Hindi selection lower side:


1. Lack of quality coaches across subjects. Most of hindi mainstream coachings rides over single personality. Even this person is good "speaker" rather than good coach, given the fast changing nature of UPSC.


2. Lack of quality Newspaper, websites and coaching portals to disseminate the requisite content. CEC, Ex Governor, Prakash singh, Top economists, scientists , even ministers et al writes columns in leading English dailies - an understanding level which no other hindi editor can achieve.


3. Level of literary development in hindi is still very less especially in technical aspects. Foreign secy or RSTV big picture panel - all are mostly English speaking people. 


4. Paper in UPSC are made by English people mainly - later just translated in other languages. Biggest Flaw/gap in CSE.


5. Hindi aspirants remains FAR FAR AWAY from real levels of competition. Sorry to say but it's reality. Competition only can help improve further even the best of bests. Mass number is not competition. Quality of competition matters. Much better in English zones like ORN.


6. Most Hindi selected people are extremely dedicated and extra hard worker self studying people. Those who leave all excuses aside and integrate best of English side like TH / RSTV Content / Best coaching CA booklets or specific topics based study after analysing PYQs. But it demand patience and perseverance which often Hindi SOCIAL MEDIA VIDEOS PHOTOS inspired aspirants lack in initial years. (Sorry if it sound politically incorrect ! But I have known quite few Hindi selected and rejected people in my journey. )


7. A few deserving ones left behind bcz of CSAT. But same stands true for English people also. CSAT is a skill - much independent of language but ARTs Vs SCIENCE/ENGG Background dependent thing. As qualifying paper it don't impact much those who deserves selection in rest all aspects.


8. Humanities mein Optional subject mein performance also depends on Medium. Understanding of Weber in English is quite different than वेबर of Hindi. Books hi nhi h Hindi mein optionals ki us level ki naa us level ki coaching h jo interlinkages smjha ske contemporary. Upsc need that dynamic understanding for top scores. 


IRRESPECTIVE OF ALL THIS ANALYSIS, SELECTION IN HINDI MEDIUM WILL KEEP HAPPENING DEPENDING ON WHEN UPSC DECIDES TO CHANGE THE RATIO OF SELECTION OR HOW MANY REALLY GOOD-GUIDED SELF-STUDYING EXTRA-HARD WORKING INDIVIDUALS JOIN THE LEAGUE.


(#Apna_Number_Aaayegaaa ) 



Best Wishes Comrades. 👍💐

Sir aapka number kab ka aa gaya. Ab humane liye bhi kuchh chhod do.

Neyawn, GaryVee and 2 others like this
4.6k views
@Agog That I said generally look for demo class videos before joining any classes. The decision is for his friend.
Ayodha DM I think is from Maithali subject.


4.2k views

Congratulations @rheecha_ratnam720  I had sleepless nights over Hindi medium guidance and accepting you in the program. I may have been around hundreds of students with Top Ranks through this community and the academy in the past 10 years, but if there are about 10 or so people who have turned tides in their favour by sheer hard work - in the past 10 years, you are one of them. It was because of you only, I wrote that it is challenging to write crisp answers in Hindi medium and Sandhi issues ( apart from other challneges in Hindi medium )


Very proud :)

For reasons more than one :)

I dont know Hindi medium results, but I am guessing you would be among Top 10!

root, Naadan_Parinda and 5 others like this
4.1k views

Neyawn said

Congratulations @rheecha_ratnam720  I had sleepless nights over Hindi medium guidance and accepting you in the program. I may have been around hundreds of students with Top Ranks through this community and the academy in the past 10 years, but if there are about 10 or so people who have turned tides in their favour by sheer hard work - in the past 10 years, you are one of them. It was because of you only, I wrote that it is challenging to write crisp answers in Hindi medium and Sandhi issues ( apart from other challneges in Hindi medium )


Very proud :)

For reasons more than one :)

I dont know Hindi medium results, but I am guessing you would be among Top 10!

Sir, she is the topper from Hindi medium. 

3.8k views

Neyawn said

So I have been working with 4 students from Hindi medium for their Mains preparation. 

I have tried to analyze the issue from a structural point of view, and will not say that the coaching you have mentioned is good or bad. There is a rational reason behind things. If you would like to know about this, you can read my post on "Why roads in Bihar are poor?" and No, Corruption is not the answer. 

Anyway, so now all the four kids have appeared for the Interview. ( I hope they are not reading it ) . But what I have seen is ( because of my inherent desire to focus on missing links - which can produce a rank under say 20 or 50 - and while it does not work all the time - the guy you expect to get a rank under 20 may land up with IRS or some other allied services, it does work most of the times ), is that the students are forced to write and express them in a language which does not have contemporary vocabulary. 

Do not get me wrong. I have high respect for Hindi, for it is not only my mother tongue, but because what can be best expressed in Hindi - primarily - tales of the middle class struggle - cannot be expressed in English that well ( Unless you are Jhumpa Lahiri in the Namesake. )

Hindi words are created by Sandhi ( conjugation of Hindi words to give a new meaning ) . Now let us say you have to write a word federalism - a Hindi word exists for it, and it is fairly well established.

But as you use a word "cooperative federalism" or "bargaining federalism" , the meaning of federalism changes completely. Hindi words for these are sometimes difficult to frame, though they can be framed. In fact they exist. But here is the challenge.

I am aware that for people studying for 2-3 years, if they dont pick up and get a Mains call, they need significant content upgradation. Even if they have been preparing for five years. 

These 4 kids ask me to join CA classes of forumias ( which are conducted in English ) .

While I believe that it will help them, the concerned faculty thinks Hindi medium students may not benefit as he is completely from South and does not even use Hindi words to explain a concept.

Mains happens, I see them make improvements and I see they are able to integrate the class ideas in their answers.

When Mains result coes, It works for them, somehow they have all gotten an Interview call. Three of them were appearing for the Interview the first time.

When I asked One of them, who already had appeared for Interview before but did not make it to final list, He said he felt a big difference between what is taught in Hindi medium vs English medium.

But it is not just quality of teaching which is a factor.

For example, this year, the CA faculty will be working to ensure that new ideas are pushed in the class so that there is a significant change and addition in vocabulary and ideas for Mains 2020 so that the students are able to express themselves in less number of words. This is what has fetched marks for say under 50 ranks - which is crucial to get IAS and a good cadre. 

So, when he adds ideas like "infodemic", "motivated blindness towards X,Y,Z", "food-dominated-purchasing-power" , "surveillance state" , - these are already floating ideas and they are "self-explanatory". What does a Hindi medium candidate do?

It is true that he is allowed to write English words, but of course the 1st attempt of the student is to use a Hindi word, which not all students will be able to do in a limited time in exam conditions.

It is also true that these ideas can be expressed without using these phrases - such as infodemic - which is "there is so much rapid spread of misinformation", but the impact these two phrases have is completely different. 

There is Hindi Medium and English Medium Coaching. There is no Hindi Medium and English Medium Professor

Here I would like to admit that the examiner who is checking your copy who is a Lecturer of Professor is a Political Science Professor or a Geography Faculty or a Sociology Faculty - but he is not a Hindi Medium Sociology Faculty or a Hindi Medium Political Science Faculty.

A Faculty is a Faculty , he is not of Hindi medium or English medium faculty. People from North - who can read and write Hindi are the ones checking both English and Hindi copies. And when they see a candidate in English able to put ideas more accurately without content terrorism, he is awarded better marks.

Why is Hindi medium selection low? -

Mass Appeal Answer : Because Hindi coachings are bad.

Deeper Answer : Because of inability to compete with English medium in terms of expressing ideas.


CSAT is a reason for less selection of Hindi  

Mass Appeal Answer : Down with CSAT. Hindi medium people cant score 67 marks because they are not only poor with English but also with Maths.

Deeper Answer : Hindi language challenges of expressing ideas in limited space introduced at the time of CSAT. 

So Hindi medium students selection has reduced because of CSAT and that it has been a watershed moment in Hindi Selections - this is only a partial truth. I will add that Limited Space QCA Booklet introduction that has had a bigger impact.

I can explain this better, but some other time. 

Reading it after many days, but these are challenges as a student /mentor working for score improvement in Hindi.

Fighter_singh,
2.6k views

TwoFace said

Neyawn said

Congratulations @rheecha_ratnam720  I had sleepless nights over Hindi medium guidance and accepting you in the program. I may have been around hundreds of students with Top Ranks through this community and the academy in the past 10 years, but if there are about 10 or so people who have turned tides in their favour by sheer hard work - in the past 10 years, you are one of them. It was because of you only, I wrote that it is challenging to write crisp answers in Hindi medium and Sandhi issues ( apart from other challneges in Hindi medium )


Very proud :)

For reasons more than one :)

I dont know Hindi medium results, but I am guessing you would be among Top 10!

Sir, she is the topper from Hindi medium. 

Yes, I came to know that. 

Fighter_singh,
2.6k views
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